Pre-show notes:
- Comments, shares, likes, and especially Reddit submissions/up votes are appreciated. The Reddit thing is big. They kinda side-eye me if I ever try to submit the column myself, so if you’re a big wig at the Squared Circle cracker factory, help us out and get the column in front of Redditors.
- Follow us on Twitter @withleather, follow me personally @MrBrandonStroud and like us on Facebook.
- GIFS courtesy of Jerusalem at Punchsport Pagoda.
- If you haven’t been reading The Best And Worst Of TNA Impact Wrestling … what’s wrong with you? You can check it out every Friday afternoon at With Leather, courtesy of the lovely and talented Wrestling Bro Danielle Matheson. It features 80% more references to Butt Stuff than the Raw column.
Anyway, welcome back. Please click through for the Best And Worst Of WWE Raw for January 7, 2013.
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/is unburied
Thanks, bro.
I’ve been hitting reload every 5 minutes, it’s finally here! Thanks Brandon, your column is like having Christmas every Tuesday.
That Fandango thing is awful.
:O
Only because he’s not a good dancer. I need to be sold on the moves.
To be fair, he’s not going to show us his best moves in his preview video. When he shows up on the Raw stage, that’s when the sparks will fly. Fandango 4 life.
He better. Those moves are robotic at best. I need to know that he sees dance as an art and not just some hobby.
Maybe he’s a dance enthusiast, but not good enough to make a living, so he has to moonlight as a pro wrestler?
It’s going to be a disaster. If you think the “Cesaro is European and has a purse” gay jokes are bad, just wait until we have a man who enjoys dancing for the faces to bully.
That latest Fandango clip seems to suggest that he’s morphing into an alter ego of Dave from Happy Endings.
If in Fandango’s next vignette includes him drinking Sangria and asking when we all turned on John Mayer, I’ll be a very happy man.
You and me both!
come, come, come, home to me!
The condition of this is that his entrance music has to be a Jim Johnston version of “Love to The Power of Love”.
Alex’s racist bird: not welcome.
Note: I’m referring to Happy Endings Alex, not beloved WRESTLING BRO Alex. He raises his birds right!
My birds show tolerance & respect.
Oh man, I hope FanDAVEgo is the start of a six-person stable. The Kerkoviches would be amazing wrestlers (and there’d be enough puns off of their names to keep Cena busy for years). If there was anyone (other than USA Guy) capable of defeating Cesaro, Jane would be my pick.
Oh B&W, how I’ve missed you.
John Cena is BLUDJORTS, leader of the fearsome GRAPPLE PAK
I will gladly buy all 5 variants of GRAPPLE PAK #1
holy shit, doing GRAPPLE PAK when JSOM is over.
Awesome. I think The Ryback can stay the same.
This is a fantastic idea. All the +’s for GRAPPLE PAK!
If the WWE is really committed to the PG audience, they are really missing out by not producing GRAPPLE PAK: TCG.
Rob Liefeld Character.. nice
I don’t know I couldn’t really get into the Punk promo, it ended up just feeling like generic heel speech #2.
You must’ve missed a lot of important information.
If that speech was generic heel speech #2, WWE would be far more entertaining than it is right now.
More like Awesome Heel Promo #6. I see your avatar is of that fucking terrible cartoon about being a college freshman, so I guess there’s no accounting for taste.
I might have missed something but I just felt that all Punk really said is that he is great and the fans are stupid and don’t matter.
I… I don’t know what cartoon you’re referring to. Does this mean I’m old now?
The promo was great, but I understand where troi is coming from. It was really long and one could fairly say he rambled a bit. Still amazing though, hooked me the entire time, and the slightly rambling nature fit well I think. He sounded like a great super villain, brilliant and a little unhinged.
Rob Liefeld reference FTW!
Glad your dad is doing better–not a good way to start a New Year, but hopefully it’s all upwards from there.
I would have to imagine now that Ryback is only a few weeks away from donning a biker jacket and wrestling on thursday nights
+NOOOOOOO
feed me more beers and sloppy seconds!
And #buttstuff!
I seriously watched Cody and Damien talk about their friendship 5 times in a row. They’re just swell.
So did I! Team Hell No better get their friendship in order because these guys are besties.
Besides both looking like something Liefield would draw, Cena does kind of remind me of Cable. They are both over the top passionate good guys for noble pursuits like Make-A-Wish kids or stopping Apocalypse but has no concern for basic good guy logic like not killing people with huge guns or being a d-bag on television.
Cena is Guy Gardner.
Rocky is here this week, and he always supplies enough buttstuff & junkstuff to even things out.
Maddox….Madox…Mad-Ox…..Ox…Beef….BEEF MODE?!
This column gets at best for the Okada reference, and TNA gets infinites worsts for having Okada for over a year and making him a Cato ripoff.
Rainmaker ftmfw
That Rainmaker is amazing! I will have to forward that vid to Mr. Barrett ASAP.
JSOM Chapter 8 is up, for interested parties.
I am an interested party! With many feelings about JSoM!
My party is full of interests for Swagger!
Rock says Punk has no nuts, but had christened his nutsack the “straight-edge scrotum”, which is empty I guess!
Awesome column, Brandon. This makes me so happy (yet slightly depressed).
If Punk only has 20 hairs on his sack, he does a much better job of shaving than I do.
Punched the air after your rant on The Rock. Well done.
You mean you just nut-shot Lil’ Jimmy!
This paragraph is probably one of my top-five all-time favourite B&W paragraphs:
“This guy can reach such heights with his character, and I love it. He can say what’s true to me and not mean it, and the fact that he doesn’t mean it makes me feel a thousand times better than if he was on Raw truly berating management for not giving Kidd a spot. The cruelty of the knife-turn, you know? That’s pro wrestling. A big, theatrical, orchestral insult to everybody watching. A f**k you for your dollar. In the same vein as a Walter White or a Don Draper, he’s a reprehensible guy who is so compelling that I can subconsciously root for his successes, mostly because they’ll make his downfall that much more special. A beautiful creep, the devil of the human brain.”
Amazing.
Agreed!
I’m sorry, but a short-arm clothesline or forearm isn’t impressive, no matter how Japanese the guy delivering it might be.
…Seriously though, doesn’t the move’s awesomeness depend somewhat on how well the opponent sells it? If Ziggler or somebody sells it like death, it looks good. If a Cena-type just falls down, it looks like shit.
Not surprised that you have the stupidest possible opinion on Okada. Wrestling fans can like particular Japanese pro wrestlers because they watched the shows and developed opinions, not just because they’ve checked “like it” or “don’t like it” on some bullshit stranger’s survey.
Yeah I don’t get the rain-maker. I’m coming around on the bullhammer. I I thought Show’s KO punch was bad at first but I loved that Kofi Kingston match months later.
And I’m not surprised you overreacted to my snarky comment and took it personally, or something. Calm down. I’m saying, it’s a short-arm clothesline. I watched the video, and yes, it looks awesome. So did Bradshaw’s Clothesline From Hell. A good clothesline looks like that. A bad one (I’m thinking Jake Roberts’ setup for the DDT) looks unimpressive. No big deal.
I didn’t “take it personally,” you said something stupid and assumptive and I called you an idiot for doing it.
OK, so to clarify… what I *actually* think is pretty much the opposite of how it apparently came across. I understand that pretty much every awesome move I’ve ever seen on American television was probably stolen from Japan. And then there’s several hundred I’ve never seen, b/c no one in America has the guts to try them.
So I’m not saying “You’re a snob because you like Japan,” or whatever you thought I was saying. What I meant was more like this: “A short-arm clothesline, no matter who’s doing it, is not a good finisher. Even if it’s delivered by a Japanese wrestler, who I understand is better at this than most Americans.”
For the record, I’m on your side Pencil-Necked Geek, Brandon gets hella defensive in the comments. He’s passionate, I get it, but you’re explaining yourself clearly and Brandon is ranting about how long he’s been a puroresu fan. No one’s calling you out, Brandon. The man explained himself, gosh.
Looking at it now, I can understand how my comment came across as racist or dismissive of Japanese wrestling. I didn’t word it very clearly. Brandon has his own opinions of me anyway, based on a bad first impression, so I’m not surprised this went the way it did. It is what it is.
HUG IT OUT!
HUG IT OUT!
HUG IT OUT!
Just responding appropriately to the “no matter how Japanese” comment. It’s not a big deal. We can get mad at each other about stupid shit from time to time.
*Runs in to hug PNG. Misses and hugs Alex*. Close enough*
#HugAll
Between PNG here and BrownsBoner at KSK, it’s a banner goddamn day for idiot commenters here at UPROXX.
Pretty stoked to be called an “idiot commenter” over a whole lot of nothing, by someone who doesn’t know me at all. Thanks a bunch.
hey, shoe fits
Really, though? Your bar must be set pretty low. I mean, I’m an argumentative jerk (case in point, bothering to respond to this); but the Internet offers SO much worse.
Well, yeah. Withleather is a really solid board 99.8372% of the time, so when some one like yourself posts here, you… stand out more than on other websites.
Well, I still think that’s pretty unfair, if it’s based only on this exchange, which was really pretty tame. But I see what you’re saying. It’s a pretty good group here.
…And I’m not *trying* to make it worse, obviously, which is why it sucks to be told that I suck, just because I was sort of critical of something.
I would like you a lot more if whenever you post didn’t result in everyone talking about the quality of your postings and brain thoughts that you click clack out to us.
Brandon definitely cares about what people think too much, but you don’t care enough. If multiple people think you come off poorly maybe you should try to think about why that is and what you can do to grow as a person.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m needlessly contrarian and enjoy disagreeing with people too much but at least own up to it when you say some trifling stuff.
Is it multiple people? I mean, I feel like the standing negativity between you/Brandon and me started when I disagreed (in a non-constructive way, probably) to the crap being piled on Punk circa June or so. Other than that, I’ve got the people in this thread today telling me I suck– people (I’m sorry) whose screen names I don’t recall seeing before.
I mean, if I’m the guy who *everybody* dreads hearing from, I’ll stop posting. I don’t want to be that guy. I thought it was just a couple of you with whom I got off on the wrong foot.
I would take a side but I don’t know who Okada is. And you don’t need to hug it out. Direct your hatred at me. I’ll be your lightning rod of hate!
I hate your stupid redshirt, RedShirt…I’m sorry, I can’t be mad at you. Hug it out?
(puts soapbox on ground, steps on soapbox)
I’m not sure if these are genuine comments or if this is Trolls doing their thing. If its Trolls then I am invoking Rule 14 of the Internet: Do not argue with trolls – it means they win.
If these are genuine comments, this is only an online summery of some guy’s reactions to fake fighting choreography with an underlining soap opera geared towards the male demographic. Its nothing to start a flame war over!
(puts soapbox away)
Enough of this. End of this conversation. Let’s just get along. Talk about wrestling further down the page, please.
I’m going to trash any further responses to this, as a heads up. It’s nothing personal.
God damn it you’re right about the Rock. He’s absolutely infuriating. He even got off to a decent start, sounded like he was going to actually focus on what Punk said, and as soon as he said the words “ice cream” I started preparing for what followed.
I’ve been thinking about this for way too long today, and here’s my problem with him: The Rock is only good when he thinks he’s better than EVERYBODY. The whole “Millions and millions” bit started as a goddamn joke, when everybody booed the shit out of him. HE was delusional about how he was better than everyone. Eventually people came around to him but he was the same guy for the most part. Now he’s as close to cornball-ass Rocky Maivia than he is the guy singing about Stone Cold in Toronto.
Don’t pander to the crowds, because they’re mostly so dumb that they’ll only understand dumb stuff. Don’t tell Punk what they’re gonna chant, because they’ll do it no matter how dumb. Say something meaningful. “Your arms are just to short to box with God” is better than anything The Rock has said since 2003, if not ever, and it’s more meaningful that any stupid thing he’s ever made trend.
Argh.
Brandon, you should try telling Destiny that she’s gold as a partner, I don’t think there’s a higher ranking compliment.
Also, Miz was actually on commentary for Cesaro vs. Khali on Main Event, so he should be mentioning it more than anyone.
I imagine when being held back by the ref, Kofi was yelling “Let me at ‘im! Let me at ‘im!” like Scrappy Doo.
Scrappy was extremely popular early on and saved the franchise.
Wait doesn’t Miz call matches on Main Event?
I had to stop watching the Rhodes Scholars bit to go back and restart it, because I realised that I went from my laptop being in my lap, to in my arms in an awkward hug. I am a million times more delighted by this than anything that happened on Raw.
Is Punk v Rock better than Rock v Cena because there’s a clear good guy and a clear bad guy (even if we all like the bad guy more), or is it better simply because Cena sucks?
It’s because Punk is great.
It’s because at some point I’m going to need to go to the bathroom, and I don’t want to miss Eve’s Wrestlemania dominance.
Danielle, if you go potty during anything Eve… >:(
It’ll be better because Punk will have someone to talk to and the feud will be over in less than 3 weeks. Cena had to talk to himself and put a feud over by himself. And when the Rock did show up, he was out of shape and homophobic
She’d be potty to miss anything featuring Eve, amirite?! *holds up hand for high 5*
I think Punk vs Rock or even Punk vs Cena is better than Cena vs Rock because Punk wants his part of the show to be the best and tries to make that happen. Both Rocky and Jern think their part of the show is already the best just because they are in it.
Cena/Rock sucked because the motivations and writing for the characters were completely incoherent. Contextually, they wrote a story where Cena was the protagonist but was forced into the heel role because the other guy was going to be cheered no matter what he did.
*High Fives Snrub*
I’m with you Doc, I couldn’t form the words correctly to express that sentiment.
I could never! Especially after finding out what a beautiful family she has.
:D
Punk/Rock is better simply on the basis that Cena/Rock was essentially two 10th graders waving their dicks in each other’s faces for a year, breaking occasionally to eat cereal.
Punk > Cena so Punk vs Rock > Cena vs Rock. Assuming the function X -> X vs Rock is continuous and increasing, which is quite an assumption.
And he has to be in a better physical condition than last time, right?
It depends on which Rock shows up. If last night’s Rock keeps showing up, it will be worse because it has the potential to be so much better. Its like the Lincoln-Douglas Debates, but Lincoln decided to show up drunk.
Ah, wasn’t Lincoln showing up drunk to the Lincoln-Douglas debates from the Asylum knockoff of “Lincoln”? I think they just called it “Abe”. :P
FINALLY Best & Worst Has returned to With Leather. *Dick Joke, Dick Joke, Dick Joke, Dick Joke, Matter Matter Doesn’t Matter Matter, Rock Bottom, End Show*
- gay joke
Good to see people coming around on my favorite divas’ (Eve and Kaitlyn) skills. Maybe I have low standards or people have high standards, but I never believed they were bad. Though I will admit they are better now than they were before.
When Eve got beat a cpl weeks ago and Kaitlynn stole her camera-pose thing, it was the first time I can remember being angry at the booking of a Diva in a long time. And I don’t mean I’ve liked the booking of the Divas, I mean that Eve, in the last month and a ahlf, has turned me into a fan to the point that I found myself yelling “fuck you bookers” at the TV in the same way I’d bitch about a Sandow squash or Cena kicking out of ten finishers and beating my boy Ziggles. Her cunty beauty queen schtick has captivated me like no Diva I can recall. That hangman chokehold in the corner is fawesome, and I don’t know why more wrestlers don’t do that spot to look like a badass. Keep it up Eve, you are the tits.
What Brandon said about Kaitlynn is spot on. Her moves (or movez) look like they actually have power behind them and make the match look believable. It’s a nice change of pace from the usual diva fare.
I guess part of it is that when I watch someone wrestle, good or bad, I also take their potential into account, so in my eyes it probably makes them better than they objectively are. I believe Kaitlyn and Eve have tons of potential to be great at WWE-style women’s wrestling (being Sara Del Rey levels of great is another story).
And at the risk of alienating myself, I believe the same of Alicia Fox. Come at me!
I panicked after the reverse DDT thinking that Eve was finished. That is how good Kaitlyn made it look. Props to you Kaitlyn for steppin’ yo’ game up! And Eve, well you already know. ;-)
@Ari : Next thing we know Alicia Fox will have a With Leather interview where we learn she is trained in kickboxing or is way more awesome than what we thought
Eve has never been WWE Diva-bad in the ring. She was immediately better than the Toris Wilson, Kellys Kelly, & Marias (her tag team partner in that match iirc) of the WWE Universe from her very first TV match. I always considered her to be on par with the Layla/McCool/Melina/AJ/Jillian/etc second tier of serviceable talents of their respective eras. Eve was clearly, CLEARLY better than the Bellas and such during what was her worst stretch of in-ring work.
Can we chalk this up to Sara Del Rey being awesome at whatever it is she does behind the scenes even if it doesn’t make sense? Because I am.
Have The Rock might be the most meta of all?
No, we haven’t because that would be dumb.
First and foremost let me say that I got into this Best And Worst column about a year ago and I enjoyed every single moment of it. So keep up the good work. I just wanted some clarification about your rant about The Rock. When you say laziness are you talking about him when it comes to the WWE or in general? I may be a little bias with my views because my favorite wrestler was/is The Rock especially Hollywood Rock (but that’s more me growing up looking at him as a role model). Just wanted to understand more before I get drunk and scream out that nobody understands him like I do lol
Laziness in WWE. His shtick is the same as it always was, but it seems like he used to put effort into making it actually funny. But that makes sense, back then wrestling was his job. Now his job is selling movie tickets, and wrestling is something he does to facilitate that. And since going through the motions is all he has to do to get a crowd to pop, that’s all he does.
But my question to that is how would you know if someone going through the motions? Say if Stone Cold came back and did his whole “what”, “Austin 3:16″ etc routine would he be considered lazy and going through the motions or just following what made him unique and who he is
It would still be lazy if that was *all* he did. Sure, you want a guy to do his “greatest hits,” I guess; but show us that you’ve got some new ideas. More to the point– show us you care enough to come up with new ideas.
I believe he is referring to the crutch Cena, Sheamus and Rocky all lean on: The Ad Hominem attack.
I’ll admit I did groan a little bit when he said cookie puss. I blame the internet for that reaction though. I guess I’m looking at this from the point of view that he doesn’t have to do this because he has a more lucrative career in something else but does it because it is in his blood if that’s safe to say that. But hey call me a Rock mark if you want. I won’t fight it lol
Why is a guy who has a lucrative career doing something else shows up when he doesn’t have to and half-asses it to make everybody look bad with corny jokes the kind of guy you’d want to cheer for?
Nostalgia? I think that’s why I’ve been willing to cut him a lot more slack then I probably should.
The problem with The Rock is that he doesn’t seem to have given any attention to what happened in WWE between WM and yesterday. He could have written this promo the day after WM, nothing would have been lost. CM Punk could be Champ for 3 years, the jokes would be the same.
I am not so quick to think he is half assing it or thinking that he making everyone looking bad. I actually think that he is helping more than hurting but everyone has a different view point on this.
I’m not sure Rock makes his main opponents look bad, necessarily. He can call Cena or Punk names all day, really. They’re both “top guys” and not even Rock’s crap will stick. The fans tuning in just for the Rock will tune out either way, even if it ends with CM Punk uppercutting Rocky into a bed of spikes at the behest of Shao Khan. All “Fruity Pebbles” did is get Cena a merchandise deal.
It’s the collateral damage, to people like R-Truth, Miz and others that’s the problem. It’s the Triple H syndrome, where the very top guys get their begrudging credit but everyone else combined is little more than a minor speed bump. The spotlight on the Rock shows the glare of the glass ceiling. Is he part of the problem? I guess, in the sense that if he demanded to lose to Trent Barreta, he’d likely get his way but I doubt that’s what people are worried about anyway.
That and as someone who chooses to present himself as a jingoistic, anti-intellectual, homophobic, childish idiot he doesn’t exactly make me predisposed to enjoying him regardless of anything else.
You could see it that way or you could see it as the other wrestlers gaining exposure due to the increase of viewers. I don’t really agree with the Triple H syndrome though because you could say that to every part timer who came back to wrestle. What did Brock do for the other stars or The Undertaker? Did anyone really rant about that? No one really said Brock came back for a paycheck, he lazy, doesn’t have any passion and all that jazz. They all were like ya he is an ass kicker and he is legit. But to each his own.
That’s all a lot of people say about Brock Lesnar and to a lesser extent the Undertaker. At least Brock doesn’t pretend he really cares one iota about wrestling and, to be honest, I haven’t really seen him take the piss out of midcarders.
The Undertaker got huge flak for YEARS, almost to Triple H “reign of terror” levels. Now he’s down to one match per calendar year which takes him all year to recover from, more or less. He’s pretty limited in what he can contribute on camera because of that.
Lesnar and Taker don’t put over new talent but they don’t cut their legs out from under them either (for the most part).
Thanks for the column. You made a 12 hour crappy day at work slightly less crappy.
Regarding the Cesaro/Khali match and Miz’ not seeing it on Wednesday, hee was on commentary for that match as well. And cut a long winded, Sgt. Slaughter promo afterwards about AMERICA and KNEEPADS.
The Rock’s shit makes me want to give up on WWE and climb into a New Japan hole. With last week’s literal shit and Miz’s cringeworthy “if you don’t love the USA then LEAVE IT” promo on Main Event, I’m pretty checked out. Right now I’m just fastforwarding every time a babyface opens his mouth.
Might I interest you in the almost not as bad TNA side of things? /shills
in TNA the mexican tag team is the face tag team, so you know… Progress.
Yeah! And they’ve got REAL LIFE NINJA TURTLES.
AND PIGEONS! Coo-Cooooo
Pigeons? NOOO! We have to set the birds free before Mr. Touchdown finds out!
But what if they’re racist?
New Japan is good. No one would blame you for this. I’m starting to watch all their 2012 stuff that’s on Youtube from I guess Wrestle Kingdom VI on. Highly enjoyable so far.
I marked out so hard when Jack Swagger’s music hit at a house show this weekend. This kid in front of me was like “whats the big deal?” and I was like “Dude, he’s Jack Swagger of Mars.” and the kid was like “I LIKE RYBACK!” so we didn’t hang out or anything.
+1
+1
+1
Page 6.
/slowclap.gif
Antonio Cesaro should be the guy who beats Punk for the title. The man is incredible and tremendously charismatic. He should be everyone’s hero. He’s intelligent, strong and a good wrestler. What more could you possibly want?
Eve is still doing excellent work. You’re spot on about the Divas division needing more wrestler face time. Eve needs to crush a lesser diva.
RE Shabbydude’s top 10 comment: Please, please tell me shabby is wrong. I’m still hoping/praying Bork Laser is going to save Punk at the Rumble.
Katilyn needs to do something about her hair. It really kind of bugs me. It’s great to see her improve in the ring, though.
I wish I were wrong, but money doesn’t lie. Last year’s WM did their highest buyrate ever, so they’re going to do it again, but this time for higher stakes.
You make an interesting point. But, isn’t making a triple threat match between Jern/Rock/Bork upping the stakes? Making those three fight for the title seems like overkill.
I dunno. It’ll be the darkest timeline if The Rock beats Punk at the Rumble.
I think WWE doesn’t pay attention to Main Event because English people watch RAW and English people can’t watch Main Event.
John Cena and The Rock are the worst parts of Raw. I thought I would never say it but I wish the Rock would leave wrestling again.
Dynamite job as always. Brandon.
Regarding the Kofi/Rose/Pacquiao/RG3 photo shop:
Why didn’t I think of that!? :(
Also, why is Kofi so small?!
Angry Brandon is Awesome Brandon.
Okay, I might be reading too much into this, but I think there’s more content actually directed at Punk’s promo in what Rock said than Brandon thinks. My distillation would be:
Punk: “When I was yelling about ice cream bars, I was BSing and manipulating the fans, because all they cheer for is characters, and they didn’t give a shit that I was the best in the world for years before that. Once I captured the belt and had nothing left to prove, I shed the character.”
Rock: “That’s a bullshit retcon. You meant what you said with the ice cream bars but _you couldn’t deliver them._ You wanted change, and instead you got more Kevin Nash. Now you’re trying to weasel your way out of your failure by claiming you never meant it in the first place.”
Now, Rock’s jokes are terrible, and God forbid he should use that time to spell out the actual story a little better, but that’s what I thought they were going for.
That would be much better, but he really didn’t say that. He brought up ice cream so he could call him Cookiepuss, and that’s pretty much it. At least, from my perspective.
Yeah I agree with this. It wasn’t all jokes and crap.
It wasn’t, but every time he got close to being serious, he backed up and went back to the dumb jokes. See the very end, when he starts getting good and then loses track talking about tattoos.
Right, he clearly loses the core of it in favor of baby talk, and frankly I almost shut it off when he walked out. But he does clearly say right near the top of it, “You talked about change, and you couldn’t do it. You talked about revolution, and you couldn’t do it. You promised everyone ice cream bars, and you couldn’t even do that!” I think that’s an interesting and coherent response to Punk’s promo, but it’s not incompatible with Rock losing the thread among his cringe-worthy punchlines.
Yeah, if that had been the focus of Rock’s promo, it would’ve been awesome. Instead it was a setup for scrotum gags.
All he had to say was “Punk, don’t try to weasel out of this, you failed”.
I hate to say it, but we all could have written a better promo for the Rock but that’s because WE’RE WATCHING THE SHOW AND HAVE A VESTED INTEREST IN IT. The Rock wants to be in the ring, I’m sure of it, he just doesn’t want to put in the effort.
I’m giving myself a mini-best because Cole didn’t even attempt the Latin for Elbow of Disdain (with a d) this week. It’d've been a full sized best if he’d used one of the 3 options I posted here in the comments. Also, I have long been conflicted by the Rock because he looks exactly like my first love. Well, between facebook and that horrid promo last night I can now say I am 100% over both their 40 year old manchild asses.
Great work as always, Brandon. Kofi’s “paragraph” with straight perfection. Also, I still love the Nexus, too.
I sat here trying so hard last night to express properly why the Rock frustrates me to no end. Then Brandon completely nails it. It’s that he has it so easy. It’s that people give him a free pass on him not trying at all and it drives me up the wall because…well that’s life isn’t it? Sometimes you feel like you’re busting your hump, and people around you who others dig just a little more seem to have it way, way easier. Rock’s become everything I hate. Never thought I’d say that.
Even in a 2 second squash match, he still manages to f*cking jump. Holy hell.
for real
I didn’t like the cookie puss comment simply because it shows too much East Coast bias. If not for memorizing Patton Oswalt’s stand up routine I would have had no idea what he’s talking about. Jr Wrestling Bros for life!
If you ever get to eat cookiepuss, you will know that it is DELICIOUS.
+1 .
“Mostly, I just want to see what the hell BEEF MODE is about.”
I think you entered BEEF MODE, (you’re Vegan so “BEET MODE”?), on the last few paragraphs of page 6! Great job.
BEET MODE. Oh my god, Alex…
I like to imagine BEEF MODE is akin to the Avatar State in Avatar: The Last Airbender. It’s when Maddox’s eyes and tattoos glow bright bluish white and he becomes all powerful, bending fire, air, water and earth to his every whim.
I imagine “Killer Tofu” plays in the background whenever someone enters BEET MODE.
Lester, if Maddox ever tries to have hair sex with anyone I am out.
BEET MODE now and always.
+1 to BEET MODE (and Killer Tofu! I’ve got a tour shirt of theirs!)
The annoying thing about the Rock to me is that he has -SUCH- an easy lane to attack Punk in verbally, and he even alludes to it with the ice cream bars thing. Punk was supposed to start a revolution or whatever, and where did it get him? Jobbing to Triple H on PPV and playing second fiddle to Cena’s dumb ass storylines. Now he says all that was intentional? Bullshit. He sold out and still failed to start some revolution, cause now he’s gonna lose to the Rock at the Rumble and play second fiddle at WrestleMania.
That’s just what I would say if I were The Rock.
That’s because you’re watching and listening. Rock is there because the Rock is there. He’s self-reflexive.
Punk was money last night. The way Rock managed to screw it up was painful. I don’t mind him doing his usual routine of boot up your candy ass, you got no balls, PEOPLE stuff. It’s him, it is who he as always been. But it only works when he uses it to add emphasis when he is saying some really important stuff. Cookiepuss is not important. It’s horrible.
Had he been all “You run around here with a shit attitude like a rootie poo candy ass, and that is the reason nothing gets done in your favor. You got less hair on your scrotum than you have reasons you should be the top dog. You aren’t here for the people? You don’t have a job without the people. I show up for the MILLIONS… AND MILLIONS because they are the only reason I get to step through these ropes. So you better face facts, before I take this boot, turn it sideways, and shove it up your candy ass at the Rumble. Because in 20 days, TIMES UP!”
Lame promo. But better than The Rock’s and I fit all his catch phrases into without calling Punk gay, or attempting to trend on twitter.
Suck a dick, Rock. At least pretend like you care enough to try, or GTFO.
Yeah, you do have the building blocks for a much better promo in there.
Also, loved your report Brandon. You sir, are the true “Best” in this article. Thank you.
-LOLZ UR GAY GET A ROOM DONT U MEAN BREAST FAG SHUTUP-
John Cena
At least I wasn’t wearing purple undies.
OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH – Miz
+1 to both of you, haha!
My avatar is actually the face he made when Miz was making the bearded/gay/kissing jokes.
Okay so some of you saw last night, and some didn’t. I’m doing a bit of a fun Royal Rumble pool, pick the 30 wrestlers in order and the 5 final people left in order. Winner will probably get something, don’t know what yet. The entry form is at the link if this pops up.
[docs.google.com]
Glad to see your Dad is doing better (went through that crap way too many times) and as usual, great column!
During the Kofi match, I like to think the ref thought it was him that knocked out Kofi with his devastating restraining power.
Not going to be a popular comment … but god dammit i love the rock and his catch phrases. hes the best of all time. also some side notes,loved cm punks shirt and randy orton should be champion hes the top wrestler going right now
I watched the rock and punk segment with 4 casual fans, a big wrestling fan and myself. They laughed at the “cookie puss” crap. My head went numb. Ugh.
Also thanks Brandon for putting into words what we’re all thinking.
Quick thought. Are we actually better off with the Rock cutting a lazy, weak, pandering promo? The lines have been drawn. Rock vs Punk is like net nerds vs mouth breathers, 12 year olds in Cena shirts vs sophisticated wrestling aficionados, Budweiser vs Pliny the Elder. Something else awesome vs something else shitty that I can’t think of through this blinding migraine I’m getting.
Point is “Rocky Sucks!”
DD, I love you so hard right now for Budweiser vs Pliny the Elder. Will you internet marriage me?
I guess the other side of the argument would be that, if the mouth breathers are going to love and cheer for The Rock no matter what he says, why not have him actually say something interesting that isn’t just lame, homophobic garbage? Maybe try to elevate the entire discourse because he’s so bulletproof that he can get away anything?
Iterum, does it matter if I have internet kids? like a lot of them.
Internet kids are negotiable. Are we talking single, double, or triple digits?
So some of you saw last night and some of you didn’t but I’m running a bit of a fun Royal Rumble pool. I did this last year with other friends and they enjoyed it. Pick the 30 wrestlers in order and the final 5 finishers in their order. Winner will get something, but I don’t know what yet.
Send me an email ( jim DOT dingeman AT gmail DOT com ) and I’ll give you the link to the entry form so anyone here can check it out. I had a wee bit of trouble with linking here so we’ll just do it this way.
Or the easier thing would just be send me a message on my profile here, of course.
Awesome! I’m definitely gonna do this. Got the link from yesterday’s live thread. Thanks!
Side note about the Rumble: wouldn’t it be nice if every time a Legend came out The Shield attacked due to the injustice of not using perfectly ready, able, and willing young guys busting their ass in the back? (just needed to get that stream of consciousness out)
p.s. This sounds like a cool pool. (and the winner of the 2013 Royal Rumble is: BRAD MADDOX!)
Unrelated to the B&W that I am so happy to have back but, Brandon did you know that in addition to Raymond the Tampa Bay Rays ALSO have a human-sized mascot version of videoboard star DJ Kitty (who is exactly what you think he is)? A picture of the two mascots together is now my desktop background at my desk in the Trop.
Also DJ Kitty belongs to one of the team’s VPs which is just freaking great.
[timenewsfeed.files.wordpress.com]
This is the best thing I’ve googled all day. +DJKITTY
I am aware. Also, I am getting my ass to Tampa.
A. Yay! Mascots and Hogan’s Beach! And baseball I guess!
B. I’m upset I actually didn’t go to the show last night solely because seeing Punk do that in person woulda been great, but I may have assaulted someone had I been there for all the “CM Gay” bullshit (especially after they cheered Dewey’s hot garbage).
C. I share a work area with three other interns and we had a draft to divide up a box of old Rays giveaway items and I am so furious I had the fourth pick and was too late to get the only DJ Kitty bobblehead. SO FURIOUS.
I think Brandon did a DugOut featuring DJ Kitty. Or I imagined that?
I think that happened for realsies, Loby. Also, hurry up, Baseball season. I want more DugsOut!
Well, if the rumors are true, Barrett is going to have a lot of time to watch Okada up close and personal, because WWE is looking at signing him.
Brilliant, fucking brilliant write up Brandon.
CM Punk is just on another level, he showered us all with pure greatness last night.
Also can I just add that it sort of pains me to read wrestling posts on ONTD. Too many Attitude Era fans who miss Jeff Hardy and think current Rock is the bomb.com.
I didn’t think The Rock was that insufferable last night. I mean my DVR stopped recording at 11:10, but he didn’t make me mad in the recorded time. Am I allowed to say that? Will I be derided for not wanting to drop fake poop on him?
Psst … I didn’t think he was as bad as he was during the Cena feud, but I only watched the WWE Nation recap video, which may have edited some stuff out. Also, I think his schtick seems all the more intolerable when it comes after a quality Punk soliloquy, plus the fact that he’s still doing a LOT of stalling and repeating himself, which seems odd given that he has an acting career now. You’d think the guy would have learned to memorize lines or ad-lib more effectively at some point in the last 10 years.
That’s a great point, but you probably don’t learn to ad-lib much on the set of Fast and Furious movies.
That Liefeld reference was a best. Great review. Welcome back!
For New Year’s Eve some of my friends threw a grunge-themed party. I don’t really own much that’s grungy, so I went to Target to find cheap one-off clothes for the event. For the jeans, I decided to grab the cheapest, worst looking, vaguely shaped, most-faded acid-wash blue jeans that look like they’ve been in the remainder bin for twenty-two years. The first (and only) pair I found that best fit that description: Wrangler dick jeans. They were the worst pair of jeans I’ve ever had the misfortune of trying on. The legs were so blobby and long (I had to cuff them up A LOT to be able to walk around, which was great for the costume). They were super unflattering and ugly. Best of all though was that they were constrictive on my junk. For realsies. There was very little room in the front of my pants, although there was plenty of extra unneeded space on the bottom so that they’d look even worse on me.
Needless to say I bought the pair because they were hilarious and because I could then share the joy of dick jean jokes with my non-wrestling bros friends (and report back to you that they’re awful jeans and none of you should seriously buy them).
You know I’ve been thinking about it: Was Rocky ever actually good at promos or did we just think he was because we were young and didn’t know any better? What awesome “criss-cross applesauce”, Cane Dewey, or Jericho debut promo did he ever cut? And speaking of the Jericho debut promo, iirc his response was Smackdown Hotel, Rooty-Poo Candy Ass, It Doesn’t Matter, etc.
He was good at catchphrases, and things that can go on T-shirts. That was all that mattered in the Attitude Era.
That’s what I was thinking. So really he’s just doing the same thing he’s always done, not realizing it’s not good enough anymore. It’s really quite sad when you think about it.
He was a master of the cocky heel promo. He was a master at taking the wind out of pompous gasbags. (Look up the promo he cut on the NWO when they first came to WWE if you don’t remember it) He was also really good at the intense staredown.
Punk went intellectual, which doesn’t lend itself to Rock’s strengths. He got close, but fell back on lazy jokes, which just didn’t fit the situation.
Watched via Hulu Plus, which I highly recommend. It’s 90 minutes, which means they cut all the filler. On occasion you lose some good wrestling too, but not often.
At the start, I found myself wondering if I would have liked John Cena when I was 12. I liked Hulk Hogan at that age, and he was actually a far worse wrestler than Cena (especially when he performs as Workrate Cena and not Superman Cena). On the other hand Hulk never tried the bullshit that Cena tries to pas off as “comedy.” I can’t believe anyone over the age of 10 buys that stuff.
As for Punk/Rock, I have nothing new to add to what Brandon said. Well spoken.
Ooh, Hulu Plus! Thanks for the tip.
Hulu Plus is a pretty good deal. Raw, SD and NXT, plus, you know, all that other TV and movie stuff for $8 a month. Check out all the Korean comedy and drama available, some of that stuff is GOLD (Vampire Prosecutor, anyone?)
Glad to hear your father is doing better, Brandon. Having been caught in the meta world of my father being compromised to a permanent end after his second heart attack literally at the same time Jerry Lawler was having his heart attack on LIVE TV, I know what it does to one’s perspective…and one’s head. Thanks for this — all of this.
Devil’s advocate: Is Rock doing anything fundamentally different than this?
[withleather.uproxx.com]
Yes. I don’t even see how it’s the same thing, other than the yelling.
Well The Rock’s a ridiculous, over-the-top character who speaks catchphrases and generally appeals to children.
I mean I’m not saying that you aren’t right about it being dumb and social regressive but I mean… you insert the “You know Mene Genes” for “The Rock says this…” and “Hulkamaniacs” for “the millions AND MILLIONS” and you essentially land on a Hulk promo.
Brandon, thank you for making me want Ken Burns presents WWE to be a thing that actually exists.
Better watch our Brandon, Burns is gonna cry about the bottom of page 6.
out*
I had no idea of what a cookiepuss was until two minutes ago. Thanks to Google, now I know why The Rock compared CM P… wait no. It doesn’t make any sense.
Great write-up Brandon, you are spot on. The Rock is pulling the same shit he did during last year’s feud with Cena, and you are right to call people out for condoning mediocrity. There’s a great article of Leitch called “It’s Not OK To Be Shitty: Guy Fieri, BuzzFeed, And The Tyranny Of Stupid Popular Things” (introduction to Dec. 27 Deadspin’s Jamboroo) making a point quite similar: it’s not because something is famously terrible that we shouldn’t call these things out.
The funny thing about that article is I have that website blocked because I was sick of how shitty the material Gawker publishes is.
I don’t get cookiepuss either.
Is it ’cause we’re both Alex’s?
For anyone wondering why they’re shit, their articles bait and switch, they pluck writers from other sites that are popular for writing certain types of articles and then not allowing them to write it (imagine if Brandon got picked up by a larger sports website, but was then told he wasn’t allowed to ever do Best and Worst or The Dugout as long as he worked for them), they mistreat their employees, go for page hits over actual content, and published that stupid article about how a woman was horrifically offended that an attractive hedge fund manager she met on okcupid played Magic: The Gathering (even though it didn’t interfere with his work or social life) and then had to go on a major news site and write about how terrible the date was (and made it extremely obvious who he was), even though by her accounts it went super well except for the fact that EWW NERD THAT’S REPULSIVE!
Oh, and they’ve knowingly posted videos/pictures of rape and what they believed at the time was child pornography. So yeah, that’s some famously terrible shit right there.
They also have it out for The Oatmeal, which huh? Out of everything to hate, why The Oatmeal?
[www.forbes.com]
Here’s a better explanation of why I don’t read their articles (other than the whole I don’t like child pornography and rape).
@chudleycannons I can’t stay on Gawker more than a minute or I’m mad for the entire day, whether because of the articles or because of the comment section. But I enjoy reading Deadspin: it’s one of the only places (with our beloved WithLeather) where sportswriting isn’t infuriating (to me). And I like Magary.
@Alex*: I’m pretty sure our awesome names are part of the answer.
But from what I gathered, Cookiepusses (ugh) have big eyes, a big nose and a huge smile. Punk doesn’t, doesn’t and doesn’t. Carry on Rocky, you’re on point.
The problem is that Deadspin IS Gawker. The shit’s the same, it’s just spray painted nicer.
@chudleycannons I remember the article about the Magic: The Gathering player. That writer can go to hell. As a reminder, I read Deadspin, not Gawker. Deadspin has been the home of some great long reads this year, for example about the greatest coach in women basketball, or Magary’s article about his third child’s birth. There’s quality over there, despite the flagship being a huge pile of turd.
(I really write too slowly)
If it hasn’t been said yet, The Rock really dropped the damn ball last night. And the sad thing is we have to listen to a month of WWE saying that he’s right and smart and you’re an idiot if you don’t agree with him.
I wish we would just get called idiots. Last time, Cena supporters were depicted as manchildren, living in their parents’ basement and I’m pretty sure that there was a additional homophobic comment.
Can’t wait to hear what’s in store for us when he realizes that some people dislike him even when he’s fighting a bad guy.
I just want to hold onto some hope that with Punk calling him on pandering and catchphrases, that he may take a more no-nonsense approach to this feud.
When they cut to commercial in the middle of Punks promo they should have just come back to a dead Punk with The Rock standing over his body holding Big Show’s giant chair. Then end the show 15 minutes early, ’cause Suits is brand new!
I’m fully on board with any idea featuring The Big Chair.
I blame the Rock sometimes for making every babyface main eventer try to be a juvenile comedian.
Before the Attitude Era, a lot of the WWF/E comedy came from the bad guys acting dastardly, like Heenan, and having it backfire on themselves so that they get their just desserts.
Now when a bad guy acts dastardly, the babyface calls them stupid and ugly and dismisses them as a threat, even when beaten in a match.
Its lunacy.
Follow up – anyone ever seen a B.A. Star event in person or online? What do they suggest kids do to respond to bullies?
I’m almost certain that their advice isn’t to tell gay jokes.
From what was broadcasted during WWE shows, they say two mains things (I’m paraphrasing): they open with “I’m big and strong now, but I was bullied too” and they conclude with “So don’t be a bully”. Don’t get me wrong, it’s great, but I can’t remember anyone mentioning how to react when bullied.
You no-sell their attack and hit your finisher, duh.
Fancy Catsup, this is genius. You’re exactly right that comedy used to be for the bad guys making fools of themselves; we used to laugh and know that Heenan was going to be made fun of for being a cheat or a “weasel”. Different sensibilities for different times?
Brandon, I turned off RAW the moment Kofi came out, because I have stopped giving any fucks about him. Checked the BCS game. Came back, match is already over. So I didn’t know what happened until I watched the video you embedded….and my reaction was the same as yours. That was just funny and awesome.
It was glorious. Probably my favorite Raw moment in years. I am easy to please.
ATTN Commenters: The cool thing about me “writing a column” on With Leather is that I’m also the moderator and editor-in-chief, so if you guys are just posting to troll me, I’m gonna spam it. Don’t get your feelings hurt. I’m too old to argue about shit with you on the Internet. If it’s criticism I don’t agree with, we can yell at each other about it, but if you’re just stopping by to call me names (or call me names in the defense of someone else) I’m not going to fuck with you.
I called you Brendan yesterday. I think I won the name-calling troll contest entirely by accident.
+1 Shabbydude
+one
Glad to hear your father’s condition seems to be getting better. That just sounds awful.
This column, however, was great. Credit to shabbydude, who won the comments last night.
Also: as much as I love Paul Heyman, him not being out there added another layer of intensity to he whole thing. It lent more credit the beef (beet).
I just read that John Cena has replaced Fred Flintstone on boxes of Fruity Pebbles. I am going to the nearby grocery stores to burn all the Cena Pebbles boxes.
If you would like to help, feel free to donate any amount of Internet dollars to the “Redshirt Bail Fund”. And please hurry, I cannot last in prison. They use people like me as currency.
I understand why Rock has to say dumbshit about ice cream sandwiches and kung-pow bitches. I remember watching the rock when he was telling Jillian Garcia that she would appreciate a taste of the Rock’s strudel when I was in middle school. AND I REMEMBER LOVING THAT SHIT.
Looking at now: GOD, I HATE MYSELF.
Am I the only one that would have legit laughed if Sheamus had called them 3MBieber?
He called them that multiple times!
Oh, my bad, I just tuned him out last night. Nowadays when I see him talking on my screen I just try to do something else. Can’t be bothered to give him the time of day on the mic, even if he might have a good line or two.
Last page of this column was the best thing I’ve read in a long time. Amazing job.
Just read the Smackdown spoilers and……oh my
You know they’re in try hard mode when they make something important happen on Smackdown.
Also, is Del Rio a heel or not? He did commit attempted homicide on Santa, but I guess being Mexican in a town full of Cubans counteracts that in WWE logic.
shabbydude: Did you see the tears that Ricardo cried? That is not someone who wanted to commit murder.
Ricardo is the most legitimate face in the entire company, but that doesn’t explain what Del Rio is. His two most likely opponents are heels, so I guess he’s a face now by default, but his character lacks motivation, which is a big reason why his earlier runs at the top were unsuccessful.
I don’t know, shabbydude. Seeing him hand over the keys to his car to help Ricardo go to his match with style? I’m pretty sold on ADR being a face, just a new kind of face. A shady face. A man who enjoys his success, but fiercely protects his personal ring announcer.
Last night was a microcosm of what a true heel and a true face is in WWE. All displayed by CM Punk and The Rock. It wasn’t clear to me what was black and white through all of that grey I thought I saw, but it’s there:
WWE not only thinks that everyone who puts the most money into their pockets are idiots, but they’ve developed almost a full proof scheme of how to get both idiots and the smarter minority to shill money to them.
And so, they build characters around this idea. WWE thinks so lowly of their fans that they feel as if the best way to connect with their audience is through comedic homophobia and grade school insults.
John Cena, Sheamus, The Miz: Three examples of their theory. They are the three top faces in WWE right now. Side Note: Randy Orton is in his own world where being a face isn’t an option for him, so he’ll be as less of one as possible until he becomes a heel. Only saying this to avoid people asking why I didn’t think he was a top face.
They are there to connect with the majority of the fans who WWE believes are nonsensical idiots. They’ll often throw you off of the scent by also referencing the smarter minority’s interests, just so it wouldn’t be obvious what WWE’s trying to do, but those three guys’ sole purpose of being a face is to connect with the consuming majority as much as possible.
I was at Raw last night, and thanks to one fan who just happened to have a seat next to me, he helped everything become clear:
During the Divas Match: Take your tops off!
Reaction to Sandow’s Pink Trunks: Kick that fairy’s ass!
Reaction to CM Punk: Get this faggot out of the ring! Rocky! Rocky!
That kind of short sighted, sexist, homophobia is everything that WWE has been fitting into their PG programming for the past few years. The WWE Universe truly does dictate who becomes the guy, and who doesn’t.
The only shining light in all of this is WWE’s greed to not completely ignore the smarter minority in favor of the majority. They don’t shill out as much money as the majority does, but every dollar sign counts. The best characters in WWE are the heels for a reason. WWE feels as if the smarter minority will always cheer for the anti hero, and so they will purposefully make every heel more complex of a character than the face. They’ll have motives, and reasoning behind everything they do because they’re made for the smarter minority.
The idiotic majority doesn’t care about that. John Cena wants to be the champion because he’s John Cena. It doesn’t have to be anything more than that to sell the product he’s selling. I’m not saying that anyone who supports a face is an idiot, and that all faces are formulaic to fit, but I am saying that I believe that WWE does. They’re not the scourge of humanity for thinking this way, but they are doing what’s best for business, and I do not fault them on that.
This might be an overblown theory of mine, but as of right now I’m convinced that last night’s promo from CM Punk and The Rock proved that WWE sees everything in black and white. The face being for the idiotic majority, and the heel being for the smarter minority. CM Punk said everything the smarter minority wanted to hear, and The Rock said everything the idiotic majority wanted to hear.
Thanks for reading if you did, and a great Best and Worst of WWE Raw as always, Brandon!
I think you’re putting too much malice behind their thought process. I honestly don’t think that much thought goes into any of it. Like any business, they do what makes them money. When it stops being profitable they adapt or die.
For a long time they had a formula that gave them a veritable license to print money in the form of the muscular superman – Sammartino, Hogan, etc.
When that well ran dry, they floundered horribly for years until Montreal and the emergence of the Mr. McMahon character, which begat Austin vs. McMahon.
So now we’re in the antihero era. They’re going to milk this cow until it dies, like they did to the last one. They’re already seeing diminishing returns in the form of lower ratings and ppv buys. But this time they have no direct competitor to force them to change faster than happens organically.
As for why the heels are better characters and more beloved by the “smarts,” well, it’s complicated.
The first reason is that wrestling, by necessity of its core conceit, pretend fighting, has to have issues simple enough to be settled by pretend fighting. Simple issues breed simple heroes. It doesn’t take Hamlet to say “That guy is a jerk and I’m going to beat him up.” (Boil down any wrestling feud ever and that’s what you’ll find at its core.) The jerk however, needs some reason for why he’s being a jerk, and so you get the motivation gap. The heel is trying to do something because reasons, and the face stands in opposition to that. It is very black and white because contrast creates drama, and drama creates interest. But it’s also very simple, and simple is boring to some people, coincidentally the type of people who complain about wrestling on the internet.
That type of person also tends to be a bit of a rebel. I know anytime I see something that’s hugely popular, I expect not to like it. But not everyone is like that. Most people are the exact opposite, or else popular things wouldn’t be popular. But we rebels tend to insulate ourselves in communities like this one, where we get the false sense that we are not the tiny minority. So while I may see a walking penis everytime Cena is onscreen, I have to remember that most people won’t see things my way. It doesn’t make me smart and them dumb, though it’s easy to feel that way. It doesn’t make me right and them wrong either. Like Brandon was saying about people who like what the Rock did last night, their opinions are equally valid, just utterly incomprehensible to me.
None of that means they disdain their fans, just that different people react to the emotional triggers in storytelling differently.
I would like to subscribe to djs92491′s newsletter.
After reading back what I said, and reading the responses, it helped me understand WWE’s thought process even more.
I remember when Bret Hart was first announced as the GM of Raw, and Vince McMahon came out to address Bret about what his job would entail: This isn’t exactly what Vince said to Bret, but it still rings true for me today. Vince said, “You have to treat these people like children.”
At the time, Vince was a heel defeated, and so it could be debated that he only said that to fit his character. However, I felt as if it was sincerely how he felt about the fans.
Looking back at what I said, I made WWE seem too much like an evil entity which wasn’t really my purpose of writing this.
It was more along the lines of exactly what shabbydude said: Like any business, they do what makes them money. When it stops being profitable they adapt or die.
I’m mainly disappointed for not driving the point I wanted to make home. I barely even mentioned it. This isn’t supposed to be a social commentary of what’s wrong with people and how they think, since I have no right and a sports blog certainly isn’t the place to do that. Neither was it a critical piece on WWE’s direction with who is the good guy, and who is the bad guy.
All WWE did was adapt to what’s popular to the majority today. From the seemingly reprehensible reality shows about over privileged party goers and overweight, superficial children, to the formulaic dance music that seemingly everyone with speaking ability can make their own song over, WWE noticed what the majority enjoys and they’ve adapted.
WWE’s a social commentary of what’s popular in the world today as much as it’s a sports entertainment juggernaut. To put it as blatantly and unbiased as possible: The face of the WWE is the personification of what’s popular in pop culture, and the heel is whatever he needs to be to oppose it.
I’m glad that I’m starting to see things WWE’s way, and it makes the seemingly reprehensible faces actually bearable to me. I understand them now, and I understand why they are the way they are. The most valid opinion in WWE will always be the majority’s opinion, and whether you support the popular opinion or not, WWE will stick with it.
If you’re wondering why the ratings aren’t up to par, even though it’s debated whether or not ratings are even relevant anymore, it’s because obviously WWE doesn’t completely understand the pop culture of today. They probably never will, and that’s because pop culture changes seemingly every day. For example, Justin Bieber is loved by his fans one day, and vilified by a few of them for smoking a joint the next.
It’ll take the perfect creative team, the perfect face and heel, and the perfect storyline to get WWE back to the dominance they once had. Back in the Attitude Era was the last time WWE was successful with encapsulating pop culture into one two hour program centered around one square circle.
I’m just looking forward to whenever that day finally happens.
If ever. :)
Spoilers for Friday Night Smackdown:
[seattlesportsnet.files.wordpress.com]
I’m an ass man.
Is it too much to ask for Punk to beat Ryback clean? He’s the best in the world, have him win like it.
I hope Punk beats Rock at the Rumble. That way Rock has to EARN a title shot at Mania. Crazy concept, I know.
or at least without the Shield’s interference, again. Let him cheat like a regular bad guy.
I guess I’m in the minority that is tired of CM Punk. I saw him come out last night and rolled my eyes. Oh great, more “Best in the World” and all his carrying on. It’s tired. I watch Raw on DVR and I literally was skipping most of what he said. I liked Punk for a good time as a heel but then the whole “Best in the World” stuff just was unrelenting and it got tired. Then the Rock came out and did more tired material. Much like most, too much talk not enough good stuff in terms of actually wrestling.
Maybe, by literally skipping most of what he said, you perhaps missed the opportunity to be engaged by the content of his verbiage!
Unlike many WWE superstars, actually listening to what he says is important to get the full effect of Punk’s character. Not always, I’ll grant you, but often.
So you didn’t listen to anything Punk said… But are tired of what he’s saying?
Seems legit.
I’d recommend giving it a chance. A lot of his recent promos haven’t done much for me, but this one blew me away.
It might be that my expectations were so low but I thought The Rock was a lot better than he EVER was during the Cena feud last night. Among all his bluster and usual shenanigans he did acknowledge that Punk was a dangerous man in a rare moment of continuity mentioned that the last time he was in the ring with Punk, Punk knocked him out, hurt him, and embarrassed him. It was nice seeing some vulnerability from Rocky even if it was a glimpse of it.
Rock being better than Cena/Rock Rock is true, but also not a compliment.
And I said all the marginally worthwhile stuff I had to say as I scrolled through the comments. Anyway, another great Best & Worst, except for Kofi. So everything that *actually mattered* was pretty on-point, lol. Hope things continue to get better with your dad & everything. Seeya on the twitters, Brandon.
So am I to believe I’m the only person who enjoyed both sides of the Punk/Rock promo? I have a pretty good memory, and Rocky was doing the same mildly funny, yet surprisingly entertaining crap 15 years ago. If you enjoyed it then (face or heel), there’s no reason not to now, even if you fancy yourself “older and more mature.” It’s just TV strung together on whim, dancing on a barely coherent thread. In other words, just like everything else on TV. My only problem with this story is the awful inevitability of Punk losing the title to someone who’s no longer a wrestler, which kind of diminishes his awesome run.
I get where you’re coming from, but I don’t think you need to put older and more mature in quotes. Growing up and putting things into perspective is a pretty awesome part of being older. It’s also about the time and the place … Rock’s wacky pervert nonsense stuff was a better fit when he was a regular, that was his gag, and everybody around him was kinda going for the same thing.
The Rock is that “funny” guy at Homer Simpson’s high school reunion. He’s still getting laughs for his Nixon and Ed Sullivan impersonations but it’s still at least as sad as CM Punk failing remedial science and losing his Most Improved Odour award.
That’s all cool with me, but his gag in 2000 was really no different than Cena’s schtick today. The only difference is that Cena is infinitely less convincing as a character. Heck, it’s no different than the backstage meanderings of Sheamus or post-wrestlemania Daniel Bryan (obviously not in terms of in-ring work). I think that to a certain extent it’s crazy to fool ourselves into thinking we’re above this stuff, when we’ve been consuming it since childhood. It’s all entertainment… there are convincing characters and there are bland, unconvincing ones. For better or worse, we’re all the target audience, because even in nitpicking at its many perceived faults, we never find it childish or repulsive enough to quit watching.
I continue to think The Rock’s problem isn’t the old catchphrases so much as he’s using them to pander to idiots now. He started calling himself “the Peoples’ Champ” when everyone hated him, started referencing the “Millions and Millions” when everyone hated him, all of it was out of narcissism. He was still a dick. That people ended up parroting it was secondary. All he’s trying to do now is get dumb people to chant silly things.
I think we have very different ideas of what tv can be. I believe that the television show is an artform and is capable of producing works of art that rival the best Dickens or Shakespeare or Homer could throw at us. I don’t believe all tv is “strung together on whim, dancing on a barely coherent thread.” I believe television should and can be built with craft and care. Yes tv storytelling does have to deal with more outside forces changing plots mid-stream than any other popular medium, but I still believe that there are artists out there that can make the best out of it and produce beautiful works of art out of adversity.
Also, just because someone liked something when they were nine doesn’t mean they’ll still like it when they’re 24. It’s fine if you never stopped liking The Rock (or anything from your childhood. I’ve been a Star Wars fan since I was four), but The Rock does nothing for 20-something me. The things I liked when I was nine are very different than what I like now. Hell, look at Brandon and compare where he was as a kid to where he was now; if he never grew as a human being, B/W would be full of homophobic, racist, sexist jokes and him talking about how great meat is. That’s not a B/W I want to read. I love my vegan-friendly pro-equality color-blind feminist B/W!
Oh, and I just realized something. You said “we’ve all been consuming this since childhood.” I haven’t! I actually started watching WWE during the summer of Punk, because Punk’s pipebomb was the only thing currently on tv that was able to give me the same thrill I got from watching Bryan Cranston on Breaking Bad (that, and as a straight edge person that wasn’t a former addict, Punk was the first and only time I’ve felt represented in any medium). To me, WWE can rival the best that tv has to offer and I keep watching it for the moments when it does. It doesn’t always hit “I am the one who knocks” levels of amazing, but when it does….
Note: that’s just the talking parts. Thanks to Chikara and Brandon I’ve come to appreciate/understand the rasslin’ parts and enjoy a lot of that now. There’s an art to what a Daniel Bryan or Antonio Cesaro does and sadly The Rock doesn’t elevate his material to art.
As for why I didn’t watch wrestling as a kid. Well, it’s because nine year old me thought it was bad. :P
1st time commenting, long time lurker here.
As a long time fan of The Rock, I truly did feel disappointed in his promo work with another favorite of mine, CM Punk. However, I do want to say that the internet shouldn’t be TOO up in arms about Rocky’s lame ass jokes. We still have a good 3 weeks left of promo between Punk and The Rock.
After these 3 weeks, if we still get crappy kiddie jokes and minimal effort from Rocky to even hang with Punk, THEN should he should feel all of our wrath, ridicule and criticism.
(I still have high hopes for this dammit!).
I mentioned it on the live thread, but I think the opening promo is the most important. It generates the controversy and storyline. Punk did his promo like his everything he is in wrestling. The Rock did his promo like he thinks his heart is in wrestling when it really isn’t. The fact that I think it would have been better for him to utter one sentence like, “These people made you who you are.” and then Rock Bottom or nothing at all shows how poorly prepared he was for a huge feud. It’s not like these guys don’t know when these things are scheduled. Put the damn time and effort in if you really want to be there.
I am probably giving WWE and Rocky too much benefit of the doubt here…..
but what if Rocky knowingly is coming into this with his scthick and is acting on it right now. Week of the Rumble is when we finally get serious Rock and he starts to legit call out Punk on his end as well.
It gives Punk more of a rub if he’s the one being serious, if he’s the one who is “ready to kick the Rock’s ass”, so to speak. Get Punk more heat and more of an advantage so we can really speculate as to who will go over at the Rumble.
then again, this is all me playing armchair WWE Creative writer…and all will be a moot point if Cookiepuss continues to trend into the Royal Rumble (God help us if this kiddie shit continues all throughout The Rock’s run).
(trying my best to see the light in this as possible!).
I posted a lot on Twitter about how I was optimistic that the Rock who showed up to feud with Punk wouldn’t be the one who showed up to feud with Cena. On Monday he was a BIT better than the Cena Rock, but he was fundamentally the same guy. He’s a talented guy, though, so there’s always a chance he’ll knock it out of my park. Nearly 100% of my animosity comes from knowing so surely that he could do better.
In Rainbows man!!! In Rainbows
I want to see what Brandon’s Nexus return would be like if it was done in the style of the old Dugout posts.
Fuuuuuuck heath slater.
I have no idea how that clown even has a job.
Because in wrestling’s three-ring circus, sometimes you need a clown to slip on the banana peel he threw on the ground earlier and few do it better than Heath Slater.
I just skip his matches :/
Heath Slater is great and you’re missing out.
Great write up as always, Brandon. Like you and like Punk I am so incredibly tired of The Rock’s played out schtick. The Punk half of that promo was brilliant, the Rock part was straight up painful to listen to.
As a side note: Any Southern California WL Wrestling Bros.™ going to PWG DDT4 this weekend?
I usually go to PWG shows but this weekend is crazy busy and tickets are going fast.
I think Efeds ruined wrestling for me.
I was raised to think the best promo means you win.
I live how everyone that claims to hate a specific part of the show (Promos, Matches) always mention how they SKIP it any time it comes up..
“Man anytime I hear [Insert Wrestler]‘s music I just change the channel, it’s never good!”
HOW DO YOU KNOW IT’S NOT GOOD IF YOU DON’T WATCH IT?!
Here’s the thing. I don’t like The current John Cena character. But I know if I sit through 9 poop joke promos, there’s a plausible chance the tenth promo is actually going to be good.
And if never watch. Ill never see it.
/rant
Everyone? Always?
I’m with Grimlock. People who skip stuff because they assume they won’t like it (you know, other than spoiler-warned poop drops and stuff) are missing out. Sometimes the bad stuff surprises you, and sometimes the good stuff ends up sucking.
I thought The Rock was fine. Was he corny, of course, always was an uber face but the one thing people are totally missing is the point of face to face promos like these. Sell the damn match. The major thing Rock/Cena lacked until like the last damn week was that their wasn’t any real point to the feud. It was week after week, two characters who are pretty much similar going after each other like two school girls. Im a fan of both but was let down by the two because of this.
Rock/Punk is great so far, killing Rock/Cena and its going to get better. We are getting some good stuff if folks would look at it from all angles. Take away Rock’s sillyness, he did a good job hyping up the upcoming match and the WWE title. Hell, even hyped Punk up. Calling his reign incredible, saying that Punk has one of the most creative minds etc. His whole promo should have been that way but whatever, the majority that like the guy want to see him act like a fool too. Just going to happen.
Punk killed it last night and Rock helped sell that Punk is more than that cowardly heel we got for the past few months. I like that Rock really isnt 100% on the mic these days because it lets the full timers he works with shine. Which needs to be the point. Regardless I am glad too see and intense feud over the title again, and I will sit back and enjoy. It helps that I like both guys but I really dont think its as bad as people are making it out to be.
I never knew there was such a thing as pretentious wrestling fans until I read this post and most of the comments that followed. And it is kind of an oxymoron really. Wrestling fans rolling their eyes at corny jokes is like watching every episode of Family Guy and still being surprised when they go off on a two minute joke tangent. Sooner or later it is bound to happen.
That being said, I think you all are really missing the point on the Rock and his schtick, as you say. Even when the Rock was wrestling full-time he always treated the sport of professional wrestling as exactly what it was and supposed to be: pure entertainment. He was a showman on the mike and in the ring and never pretended like it was real, like some wrestlers, which–in my opinion–is more corny than any of the Rock’s jokes.
I believe that the majority who are on here bashing the Rock are still harboring resentment over the fact that he left the sport when he was in his prime, and that even when he comes back months (or years) later after a long layoff, he is still better than the rest of the jobbers on the show. On his worst day he is better–and gets the loudest pops–than everyone else, and that agitates the majority of the “hardcore” fans.
Does anyone really think that the current “stars” of the WWE would have gotten any air time back in the day when the Rock, Triple H, Stone Cold, Kurt Angle, etc. were competing? Randy Orton? Please. CM Punk is pretty good, but he has the physique of a 12 year old boy with a tattoo fetish. Gangsta rap John Cena was great, but current John Cena is corny, kind of like the Rock’s jokes I guess. But everyone laughs at them, so therefore he keeps telling them. Not to mention that the entire WWE is a bit less edgy now, so of course all the jokes will have to have a certain element of corn to them anyways I suppose.
This ain’t Masterpiece Theatre, this is professional wrestling people. Lighten up and continue to worship the current watered down product until it returns to prominence once again. Then maybe they wouldn’t have to bring back the Rock every so often to pick the show–and the other wrestlers–back up again.
Rock fans showing up with the “it’s just wrestling” excuse, more reliable than the stars in the sky.
I feel dumber having read Bender3′s comment.
Which, good news, means I suddenly enjoy the word cookiepiss more! Haha it’s ice cream but sounds like maybe it’s vagina. Oh Rock. #COOKIEPUSS
OOOOhhhhh, I get it, he simply could not contain his gayness so he had to grab your ass during a match. Oh Sheamus, your silly hi-jinks don’t just stop at racism
I think that the noise the crowd made when Cesaro was lifting up Khali was my favorite part of the entire show …